NS Cliches: Rebooted

by **Sengoku Americas** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:24 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:RE: the topic of young characters.

It honestly depends on how realistic you want to be. Frankly, modern nations tend to have older heads of state for a reason: young people tend to be really fucking stupid, and this is reflected in a lot of the attitudes held towards young politicians. Of course, this is no reason to become a full-blown gerontocracy (looking at you, USA), but I think taking power at any age between 18 and 30 is stretching it a little.

Unless, of course, you have a particular national culture that values youth; or political intricacies which have thrust the role of leadership upon a young person (i.e., an absolute monarch dying while their heir is still in their 20s). If you want to have some magic fantasy world where everyone's looking young and fresh no matter their age, go ahead -- but I don't think it's good if you're going for gritty realism. Heads of state are rarely youthful and handsome, they're old and portly. A lot of NSers just don't really like to come to terms with this.

I think most users perfectly understand the reasons why heads of state tend to be older.

by **Aureumterra III** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:24 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:RE: the topic of young characters.

It honestly depends on how realistic you want to be. Frankly, modern nations tend to have older heads of state for a reason: young people tend to be really fucking stupid, and this is reflected in a lot of the attitudes held towards young politicians. Of course, this is no reason to become a full-blown gerontocracy (looking at you, USA), but I think taking power at any age between 18 and 30 is stretching it a little.

Unless, of course, you have a particular national culture that values youth; or political intricacies which have thrust the role of leadership upon a young person (i.e., an absolute monarch dying while their heir is still in their 20s). If you want to have some magic fantasy world where everyone's looking young and fresh no matter their age, go ahead -- but I don't think it's good if you're going for gritty realism. Heads of state are rarely youthful and handsome, they're old and portly. A lot of NSers just don't really like to come to terms with this.

A lot of people’s leaders are just there for horny fantasies, as others have pointed out

12 March 2022

South Reinkalistan wrote:RE: the topic of young characters.

It honestly depends on how realistic you want to be. Frankly, modern nations tend to have older heads of state for a reason: young people tend to be really fucking stupid, and this is reflected in a lot of the attitudes held towards young politicians. Of course, this is no reason to become a full-blown gerontocracy (looking at you, USA), but I think taking power at any age between 18 and 30 is stretching it a little.

Unless, of course, you have a particular national culture that values youth; or political intricacies which have thrust the role of leadership upon a young person (i.e., an absolute monarch dying while their heir is still in their 20s). If you want to have some magic fantasy world where everyone's looking young and fresh no matter their age, go ahead -- but I don't think it's good if you're going for gritty realism. Heads of state are rarely youthful and handsome, they're old and portly. A lot of NSers just don't really like to come to terms with this.

Unless it's a hereditary position, agreed. The youth do not have enough life experience or wisdom to run a nation, and, if a younger person is in power, the chances they will rely on older advisors is fairly high. That could create a very interesting premise and power dynamic that could go in multiple directions and be a thrilling story.

But there is a reason countries with elected leaders have minimum ages to run for leadership positions: they want people with fully developed brains (the brain develops until age 25, and then it's downhill from there :blink:

). And, if you look at the world's current youngest-serving leader, he's 29; the second-youngest world leader is 34. Both are elected positions (I think), but they're not young enough to be university students or anything.

And you're right about heads of state being middle-aged/older and portly. I actually went in that direction with Alastair, and then I opened a can of dRAMA AND TRAGEDY, so he has lost a lot of weight--but still. My leaders are not out to win beauty contests (ok, except maybe Alastair I).

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:31 pm

Las Palmeras wrote:Is there anybody mad enough to turn Mitch McConnel into an anime femboy in this site?

uwu

12 March 2022

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Las Palmeras wrote:Is there anybody mad enough to turn Mitch McConnel into an anime femboy in this site?

uwu

There we go. All better now.

by **Kyoki Chudoku** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:36 pm

Technically the youngest leader I’ve had for a nation I remember was sixteen- but then that was an alien lifeform for which sixteen years is over half the lifespan up already.

Aozora’s officially listed as twenty-five, but then she’s claimed that for multiple years so absolutely nobody believes it, they just don’t want to make a big deal out of it. I believe she was probably younger than that claim when she assumed power- through violence and magic, I should note- but she’s certainly a fair bit older than it now. And so she went from claiming to be more mature than she was to claiming to be younger than she is.

Chudokuren leaders in general aren’t really supposed to be especially wise. They’re basically varying flavours of insanity. So perhaps the initial youth of many of them can be considered thematically appropriate in the sense that they were pretty much forced into these positions by a sadistic psychopath.

by **Kiu Ghesik** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:37 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Las Palmeras wrote:Is there anybody mad enough to turn Mitch McConnel into an anime femboy in this site?

uwu

~~hot~~

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:37 pm

Sengoku Americas wrote:I think most users perfectly understand the reasons why heads of state tend to be older.

Amount of people with really young leaders despite no reason/explanation for them to be there? Doubtful.

Kiu Ghesik wrote:Ari's, if I can toot my own horn, an example of this- her particular justification for being young, apart from the whole "warrior woman" trope, is very much a result of her political situation. Her father was physically incapable of producing heirs past her as a result of injury, and as a side-effect of that injury he died well before he "planned" to, which serves as a significant character motivator through her defining herself largely as his successor and as being illegitimate as an independent individual.

Uh huh. Though this does bring me onto another thing: unusually competent young leaders are also oddly abundant. Like, sure, your guy's now in charge of the country, but they're still really young and that should be reflected in critical mistakes and/or general fuck-ups on their path. I'm writing my leader's factbook right now, and he takes power in his early thirties; at that point, he's still got much to learn and makes a bunch of errors that endanger his rule until he can secure the reigns.

by **Sengoku Americas** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:40 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Sengoku Americas wrote:I think most users perfectly understand the reasons why heads of state tend to be older.

Amount of people with really young leaders despite no reason/explanation for them to be there? Doubtful.

As you said, lots of people don't play- or aim to play- very realistically (including myself).

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Kiu Ghesik wrote:Ari's, if I can toot my own horn, an example of this- her particular justification for being young, apart from the whole "warrior woman" trope, is very much a result of her political situation. Her father was physically incapable of producing heirs past her as a result of injury, and as a side-effect of that injury he died well before he "planned" to, which serves as a significant character motivator through her defining herself largely as his successor and as being illegitimate as an independent individual.

Uh huh. Though this does bring me onto another thing: unusually competent young leaders are also oddly abundant. Like, sure, your guy's now in charge of the country, but they're still really young and that should be reflected in critical mistakes and/or general fuck-ups on their path. I'm writing my leader's factbook right now, and he takes power in his early thirties; at that point, he's still got much to learn and makes a bunch of errors that endanger his rule until he can secure the reigns.

You bring up an interesting point about decision making and other cognitive capabilities of leaders based on age, and I wonder if there's any good literature on that subject. I'll let you know if I find anything convincing suggesting one or the other.

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:42 pm

Sengoku Americas wrote:As you said, lots of people don't play- or aim to play- very realistically (including myself).

Sure. But plenty of people do as well.

South Reinkalistan wrote:You bring up an interesting point about decision making and other cognitive capabilities of leaders based on age, and I wonder if there's any good literature on that subject. I'll let you know if I find anything convincing suggesting one or the other.

I mean, it's common sense as far as I'm concerned. Twenty-year-olds just don't tend have the experience to be running a country -- something which isn't exactly an easy task. Getting someone barely out of their teens to run a country without any hitches is getting into Mary/Gary Sue territory, to be frank.

by **Dayganistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:44 pm

It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

12 March 2022

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Sengoku Americas wrote:As you said, lots of people don't play- or aim to play- very realistically (including myself).

Sure. But plenty of people do as well.

South Reinkalistan wrote:You bring up an interesting point about decision making and other cognitive capabilities of leaders based on age, and I wonder if there's any good literature on that subject. I'll let you know if I find anything convincing suggesting one or the other.

I mean, it's common sense as far as I'm concerned. Twenty-year-olds just don't tend have the experience to be running a country -- something which isn't exactly an easy task. Getting someone barely out of their teens to run a country without any hitches is getting into Mary/Gary Sue territory, to be frank.

And Mary Sues/Gary Stus are annoying as all heccin' hecc.

by **Shov Scien** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:47 pm

'Somehow rules several galaxies or even universes' seems to be an increasingly common one.

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:49 pm

Dayganistan wrote:It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

I mean sure, this can be the case. But a lot of attractive looking young people do end up looking less so when they're well past their prime.

I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)

by **Kiu Ghesik** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:51 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)
(Image)

Unironically that looks excellent, and I should probably figure out how to do something like that for some other stuff. It really does look great.

by **Comerciante** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:51 pm

FT wankery demands one not to actually consider the scale of governance required to maintain empires that long or that the leader is so good at what they do that everything just works.

In TGSW the government works in theory! maybe! sometimes! not really! It almost got tax returns filed once! probably...

Edit: For an entirely wrong part of the population...

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:52 pm

Kiu Ghesik wrote:
South Reinkalistan wrote:I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)
(Image)

Unironically that looks excellent, and I should probably figure out how to do something like that for some other stuff. It really does look great.

Don't worry lol, I cheated -- I just colourised an old photo of a Soviet naval officer

by **Sengoku Americas** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:52 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Dayganistan wrote:It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

I mean sure, this can be the case. But a lot of attractive looking young people do end up looking less so when they're well past their prime.

I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)

Taking good care of yourself is more important and impactful than many realise. Having an excellent skincare and haircare routine, having enough water, eating healthy, sleeping sufficiently, exercising, not smoking or excessively drinking, maintaining a healthy weight, and taking note of any unhealthy symptoms are just a few ways you can make your appearance age more slowly.

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:52 pm

Sengoku Americas wrote:
South Reinkalistan wrote:I mean sure, this can be the case. But a lot of attractive looking young people do end up looking less so when they're well past their prime.

I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)

Taking good care of yourself is more important and impactful than many realise. Having an excellent skincare and haircare routine, having enough water, eating healthy, sleeping sufficiently, exercising, not smoking or excessively drinking, maintaining a healthy weight, and taking note of any unhealthy symptoms are just a few ways you can make your appearance age more slowly.

What if your leader doesn't do these things, because your leader isn't necessarily a perfect human being?

by **Illegal Planets** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:55 pm

Lurking.

12 March 2022

Sengoku Americas wrote:
South Reinkalistan wrote:I mean sure, this can be the case. But a lot of attractive looking young people do end up looking less so when they're well past their prime.

I did take note of this however. That's why my leader has aged f-a-n-t-a-s-t-i-c-a-l-l-y (i hope)

Taking good care of yourself is more important and impactful than many realise. Having an excellent skincare and haircare routine, having enough water, eating healthy, sleeping sufficiently, exercising, not smoking or excessively drinking, maintaining a healthy weight, and taking note of any unhealthy symptoms are just a few ways you can make your appearance age more slowly.

Yup! It is harder in practice than it sounds, methinks, especially the sleeping part when you're, like, YAY GOOFING OFF ON COMPUTER TIME UNTIL 2 IN THE MORNING! (Points to myself).

Dayganistan wrote:It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

This is also true, unless something drastic happens in a person's life or a health problem arises. *Pats Alastair on the head.* And it doesn't automatically make one bad-looking.

by **Hamatu** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:00 pm

South Reinkalistan wrote:
Sengoku Americas wrote:Taking good care of yourself is more important and impactful than many realise. Having an excellent skincare and haircare routine, having enough water, eating healthy, sleeping sufficiently, exercising, not smoking or excessively drinking, maintaining a healthy weight, and taking note of any unhealthy symptoms are just a few ways you can make your appearance age more slowly.

What if your leader doesn't do these things, because your leader isn't necessarily a perfect human being?

Having a lot of power and influence kinda makes keeping track of and maintaining routines less the business of one perfect person, and more that of a team of people whose livelihoods depend on that person, possibly? (Seems like an interesting perspective to take to me at least

)

by **The Gamer Utopia** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:00 pm

If your nation takes place in a more distant future, then it does make more sense to have old leaders look young because their life-spans should be longer. My main, Zeloria, for example has nano-machines that pretty much make you immortal. One thing that bugs me in a lot of sci-fi is that humans often have the exact same lifespan as today, even if it takes place hundreds of years in the future.

by **Feyrisshire** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:01 pm

Dayganistan wrote:It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

I will give one example of a real-life state where its two most powerful leaders are young and attractive - DPRK.

Link

Granted that I am playing as a Marxist-Leninist socialist state whose leader is in her 30s and physically attractive I feel entirely justified considering it has a real-life parallel.

by **South Reinkalistan** » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:04 pm

Feyrisshire wrote:
Dayganistan wrote:It's entirely possible to have an appropriate aged leader who is also physically attractive. People don't magically turn into overweight blobs when they hit 45, and if they do they were probably getting to or at that point long before then.

I will give one example of a real-life state where its two most powerful leaders are young and attractive - DPRK.

Link

Granted that I am playing as a Marxist-Leninist socialist state whose leader is in her 30s and physically attractive I feel entirely justified considering it has a real-life parallel.

oh god no please don't let the "is kim yo jong attractive" debate start i swear to god please no

NS Cliches: Rebooted

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